Why Are Young Men & Women Drifting APART? (Feminism, Masculinity & Political Correctness)
Connie and I delve into the complex world of political discourse, exploring the idea that we need greater integration between the centre and the fringe of political thought. We discuss how many young people are feeling lost in today's polarised landscape, where it seems like you either fit into one box or the other—no in-between allowed! Connie shares her experience at a recent conference, where she saw firsthand how people are craving a space to express their thoughts without the fear of being "cancelled." We explore the real reason behind this disconnect and how the rise of social media and dating apps is changing the way we connect (or, you know, don’t connect) with one another.
Diving deep into the heart of societal discourse, Connie and I tackle the often murky waters between the mainstream and the fringe. Our chat kicks off with the realisation that many ideas we assume are held by a select few resonate with a larger audience. We explore the concept of feeling politically homeless, especially among the youth, who often share their frustrations about lacking a safe space for open discussions. From attending the Reform UK conference and hearing firsthand the voices of young people yearning for dialogue, it becomes clear that the lines drawn in political sand often lead to isolation rather than integration. We need to bridge this gap, folks! The episode is packed with insights on the importance of open debate and how our current cancel culture can push individuals into echo chambers instead of fostering understanding. So grab your headphones and join us as we navigate these complex dynamics, all while keeping things light with our playful banter and cheeky humour.
Takeaways:
- Connie and I dive into the idea of the 'fringe' in society, where folks feel stifled by mainstream opinions and seek new spaces to share their ideas and concerns freely, which is totally essential for healthy discourse.
- We chat about how young people today feel politically homeless, and how it's creating this wild divide between their beliefs and the mainstream narratives, leading to a lot of frustration and confusion.
- There's a big discussion about the lack of integration between the centre of political thought and the fringe, which Connie argues is crucial for open debate and understanding among different groups.
- We tackle the scary reality that many people are afraid to challenge their beliefs, fearing that doing so might expose them to the idea that they could be wrong, which is a heavy load to carry, right?
- Connie brings up the concept of ideas being like viruses; once they take hold, they're tough to shake off without feeling like you're losing a part of yourself, which is a mind-bender.
- We explore the dynamics between young men and women today, noting how polarisation and the rise of social media are affecting relationships and conversations, making it harder for people to connect in real life.
Companies mentioned in this episode:
- Reform UK
- Vivek Ramaswamy
- Elliot Bewick (Next Gen Podcast)
- Loughborough University
- Movember
- Leeds
Transcript
I think it's impossible to say what is in the center and what is in the.
Speaker A:In the.
Speaker A:On the fringe.
Speaker A:Because the reason why I titled my podcast the Fringe and put it in speech Marks is because there are lots of ideas that we assume only very few people hold.
Speaker A:I think that there needs to be more integration between the center and the fringe.
Speaker A:And I saw that when I went to the Reform UK conference in September and I went on a media pass.
Speaker A:And just from talking to the majority of young people, there were boys, and they were all telling me how they.
Speaker A:Basically the theme was they had nowhere to fit in anymore politically, so they had found a space where they could talk about their concerns freely.
Speaker A:And this is what's going on with all these ideas is that you get canceled from the cult and then you get pushed in to another area where you can talk freely.
Speaker A:And I'm very conscious of the fact that I've been pushed out of one area and welcomed into another one.
Speaker A:And I don't want to become susceptible to the cult, think of the new cult that I'm in.
Speaker A:So I think that there needs to be more integration between what you would consider the center and the fringe so that we can have open debate.
Speaker A:And that's the main issue that we have, is that people are fed up of.
Speaker A:Not fed up.
Speaker A:Sorry.
Speaker A:They will refuse to talk to each other.
Speaker A:That's all of the reaction I've had from students who I'm asking, please come and speak to me.
Speaker A:And they just say, you like.
Speaker A:I do not.
Speaker A:I'm not obliged to give you a conversation.
Speaker B:I won't entertain you.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:They absolutely no desire to want to have their views challenged.
Speaker A:And they.
Speaker A:They think that I don't want mine.
Speaker A:They keep saying, I don't want my ideas challenged, even though I'm asking them to challenge me.
Speaker A:I think that people are scared that if they do talk to people they disagree with, that maybe they will conclude that they were wrong.
Speaker A:And I think that's a very scary thing for most people to think that your ideas for a long time weren't true.
Speaker B:Carl Jung said that people don't have ideas.
Speaker B:Ideas have people.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And he's absolutely spot on.
Speaker B:And we judge our position in the hierarchy of the world or the species is often attached.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:It's like I was thinking about this the other day.
Speaker B:What's so difficult about ideology and ideas in general is that they're like viruses.
Speaker B:They're not bacteria.
Speaker B:So bacteria live amongst the cells.
Speaker B:So you can kill a bacteria.
Speaker B:But viruses live inside the cell.
Speaker B:So you can't kill a virus without killing the cell.
Speaker B:And that's one of the da.
Speaker B:That's one of the problems with ideas is people conflate their ideas with, with who they are.
Speaker B:We all do it.
Speaker B:But any, I mean, even if you support a football team or a sports team, if that team loses, you get depressed, or if that team wins, you.
Speaker B:You get a boost in testosterone or dopamine or whatever serotonin, that's you.
Speaker B:That idea, the concept is lived, has merged itself with you, and you are now incumbent and dependent on that concept.
Speaker B:And it, it shifts and it, and it maneuvers with you.
Speaker B:But yeah, don't cancel me anyone, because that's not what I meant.
Speaker B:But yeah, so it's, it's very, very interesting.
Speaker B:And yeah, sorry, just what did I put down?
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, so you're talking about what's at the center.
Speaker B:I'll tell you what's at the center.
Speaker B:In my, my opinion, it.
Speaker B:A monogamous family, stable unit, regardless of gender, regardless of sex, whatever, but a monogamous stable family unit.
Speaker B:There's Vivek Ramaswamy, who ran for Regardless of Anyone's Opinion.
Speaker B:It's not about politics, this.
Speaker B:But he's written a book after his campaign in the US general election.
Speaker B:And one of the chapters is the Nuclear Family is the greatest form of governance ever created.
Speaker B:And I, that's gone through my mind a lot.
Speaker B:I thought, why are so many young people wrapped up in all this bollocks that's going on at the moment in society?
Speaker B:And I thought no one's getting into relationships anymore.
Speaker B:So therefore, not that I wanted to get too deep, but if you from a not heterosexual home, regardless, the masculine and the feminine, when they combine together, they create the unity that I believe is, is, is a sacred unity.
Speaker B:And I don't mean men and women.
Speaker B:I mean the masculine and the feminine, the left and the right brain, whatever you want to call it.
Speaker B:And I think part of the reason why, and one of the reasons why it's so dangerous to use Elliot Buick's favorite word to bifurcate young men and women is because the more you bifurcate young men and women, the more you destabilize society as a whole.
Speaker B:And I think it's a real problem.
Speaker B:The fact that that is happening now and the vitriol and the hate between the two sexes is really, really problematic.
Speaker B:And I don't think it's ever been worse now than it ever has been.
Speaker B:I don't think women have ever been more scared of men as A collective.
Speaker B:And I don't think men have felt more disillusioned or separated from young women either.
Speaker B:And that's really not good, actually, because when you watch.
Speaker B:This is a real tangent, but I think it's really important.
Speaker B:When you watch old fairy, Disney fairy tales, the final shot is the prince awakens the princess.
Speaker B:Regardless, there's a reason behind that, but that's not important.
Speaker B:The camera pans up to a paradise.
Speaker B:They go off, they ride off into the sunset, and the camera pans up.
Speaker B:And everyone views that as, through the feminist lens of, oh, my God, isn't it wrong?
Speaker B:Women don't need men, how dare he kiss her when she's unconscious.
Speaker B:Et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker B:Fair enough.
Speaker B:That's not what it means.
Speaker B:It means that the masculine and the feminine awaken each other for different reasons.
Speaker B:And it means that when they're successfully combined, that's when paradise is created.
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker B:That's what I believe.
Speaker B:I think.
Speaker B:And that's true.
Speaker B:Psychologically, socially, societally, that's the same thing.
Speaker B:What's your opinion and what do you think the potential problems are that could ensue as a result of this bifurcation of young men?
Speaker B:Not even with regards to politics, just in general.
Speaker A:I think it's possibly just another symptom of, in general societies becoming so polarized in every aspect, whether it's politics or.
Speaker A:Yeah, politics.
Speaker A:General ideas or.
Speaker A:And those things seem to be split by sex as well.
Speaker A:The right being predominantly male and the left being predominantly female.
Speaker A:I don't know how much.
Speaker A:I actually think a lot of it comes down to technology and the fact that young people have smartphones and so they're less inclined, they don't have to speak to each other face to face.
Speaker A:I mean, I don't know if it was like this.
Speaker A:I'm not.
Speaker A:I don't know how old you are or what it was like for you when you were in, like, early years of secondary school.
Speaker A:But in year seven, 25, okay.
Speaker A:Quite similar when I was in year seven.
Speaker A:My boyfriend at the time, still my friend.
Speaker A:Our relationship was entirely via WhatsApp.
Speaker A:And it's like seeing each other in person at school was actually terrifying.
Speaker A:Even though we'd told each other we loved each other message.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I think that's.
Speaker A:That is just.
Speaker A:And the same thing with dating apps now.
Speaker A:People aren't getting into relationships.
Speaker A:And even though you think at university you'd be meeting new people all the time, it actually.
Speaker A:And I'm not the only one who feels this way.
Speaker A:My housemates Feel the same.
Speaker A:It feels almost impossible to meet someone naturally in a romantic way.
Speaker A:And so everything is just done via hinge or Tinder.
Speaker A:And so there's automatically the separation.
Speaker A:But I.
Speaker A:I do feel like I can actually see it happening in real time in my own life that when I was at school I wasn't friends with the boys.
Speaker A:And if anything, I was actually terrified of them because I found them really intimidating.
Speaker A:And I knew they didn't like me because they were afraid to say anything around me because they.
Speaker A:They were worried that I was going to report them.
Speaker B:How old was this?
Speaker A:This is in sick form.
Speaker A:I wasn't friends with the girls.
Speaker B:You're at that age then.
Speaker A:So we'd sort of.
Speaker A:We would go to the same.
Speaker A:I would go to some of the parties, but I wasn't actually friends with the boys.
Speaker A:But since leaving school, I've become a lot more better friends with them.
Speaker A:And I.
Speaker A:And I actually love having male friends.
Speaker A:And I don't know if that's because of my sense of humor and the fact that I have.
Speaker A:I'm very.
Speaker A:I have a very sort of dark and vulgar sense of humor to the point where I can.
Speaker A:That other girls, my.
Speaker A:Or other girls who were friends with the boys at school at the time could get on with it.
Speaker A:And now they've sort of looked back and think and.
Speaker A:But I've sort of had the flip where it's like I.
Speaker A:I don't know why I was so bothered by it at the time or had such a strong moral compass that I thought that their sense of humor was outrageous.
Speaker A:I mean, it's not.
Speaker A:It wasn't even that bad.
Speaker A:But I just.
Speaker A:For some reason now I feel like I'm much better friends with them than I was when I was at school.
Speaker A:And I don't know if that's because I've realized that my own ideas at school, I don't agree with them anymore.
Speaker A:And I find it a lot easier to.
Speaker A:To be around their culture.
Speaker A:Just being boys together, I think relaxed and fun.
Speaker B:The eradication of a dark sense of humor from sort of like a.
Speaker B:Not that I like looking at things from societal point of view because it doesn't actually exist, but from a societal point of view is exceptionally dangerous.
Speaker B:And I think that leads in back into the idea of political correctness.
Speaker B:I think the fact that young men are more likely to less politically correct is in keeping with their tendency to be.
Speaker B:To have a dark sense of humor.
Speaker B:And I think you swap.
Speaker B:You swap a dark sense of humor for a dark state of being or something for you?
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:It's literally just come to my mind so I don't know how to articulate it perfectly.
Speaker B:But if you get rid of.
Speaker B:If you don't allow that, that's the sign of a tyrant.
Speaker B:Actually a tyrant is someone who removes humor and tyranny is the deliberate removal of nuance.
Speaker B:Is a great quote that someone said and the king needs a jester, jester gesture jester.
Speaker B:Because without a jester they become a tyrant because they need someone who keeps them in check.
Speaker B:And that's the point of the thing.
Speaker B:When you say that you're so do you.
Speaker B:Do your friends not want to meet people on social media dating apps or do they want to meet them in real life?
Speaker A:They do, but it's because it feels I.
Speaker A:It's chicken and egg again.
Speaker A:I don't know if it's because it is actually really hard to meet someone in real life or that because dating apps exist people have given up trying to meet people in real life.
Speaker B:What do.
Speaker B:How do they want to meet people in real life?
Speaker B:Like someone approached them?
Speaker B:Is that what you mean?
Speaker A:I don't even know.
Speaker A:I think at least from my personal experience and my housemates who I talk like specifically the housemates I talked to about this.
Speaker A:We both do courses that are very female heavy.
Speaker A:So when I in my first year I lived in an all girls flat.
Speaker A:My course is nearly all girls and psychology spare time was taken up playing now and so I was never around boys.
Speaker A:If I was it would be in a nightclub.
Speaker A:And so your only option like meeting someone at a nightclub is just never going to be the stable basis of a flourishing relationship or if it is then you're very lucky.
Speaker A:I think.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's just there aren't.
Speaker A:I think people have become very insular in their friend groups and it's very tribal.
Speaker A:Like the idea of mixing friend groups where you'd meet a friend of a friend seems to be not a thing.
Speaker A:Like when my parents talk about how they have all their friends met their partners, there's always through people that they already knew but that just doesn't seem to happen anymore and people are sort of less keen to socialize in general.
Speaker A:So you're never meeting new people in a.
Speaker A:In a way that it's not complete.
Speaker A:It's like you've not have to go up to them randomly.
Speaker A:It was an organized event where people from different groups were invited.
Speaker A:So you were.
Speaker A:It wasn't random that you all sat together and ended up talking to each other like that.
Speaker A:To me, just seems to happen very rarely.
Speaker B:The.
Speaker B:When you look at the.
Speaker B:The rise of someone like the bull, I'm not going to say his name because I don't think you can say his name, but someone like the bald man from Romania, you.
Speaker B:When you delve deep into why that occurs, you can kind of see the, the logistics and the, the logic behind it.
Speaker B:Because I believe that the psyche and then the, like the collective unconscious or conscious is always looking for some sort of equilibrium.
Speaker B:So I.
Speaker B:One of the things I've noticed a lot is the amount of young women, not even young women actually, but women in general that dye their hair blonde, put fake eyelashes on and get their lips done.
Speaker B:And I look at that, and I think you're trying to be the archetypal woman.
Speaker B:You're trying to feel more feminine.
Speaker B:And why is that?
Speaker B:It's because society is trying to make you more masculine.
Speaker B:And there's something in you that is saying either that or it's another example of an, of an mpi.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:And obviously this is a very sort of rogue comment, but I think there's something going on there where it's like you feel your femininity feels undermined.
Speaker B:So you're trying to make yourself feel more feminine because those are tradition, sort of traditionally feminine features, because blonde hair is associated with youth and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker B:So what's your opinion on the degree to which we've elevated some people in society as these are the people that we really need to look after, and yet sort of going back to what I said right at the beginning as we close up, and yet that has sort of pushed other people out, mainly men.
Speaker B:And the justification behind that is because, oh, well, we've all existed in an oppressive patriarchy, so therefore it's fine, it's justifiable.
Speaker A:Well, I mean, I don't necessarily agree entirely with your analysis on it in the sense that I think for a long time women weren't able to come together to look after themselves.
Speaker A:So throughout the 20th century, that's what they ended up doing.
Speaker A:And they decided that the only way that they were going to achieve equality or more rights was if they mobilized together.
Speaker A:So feminism is about women, is done by women for women.
Speaker A:And I think that men have become butthurt that women do not see men as their responsibility anymore.
Speaker A:We used to sort of see women as being, oh, we're looking after the children and our husband.
Speaker A:What's stopping men from coming together to look after their own issues?
Speaker B:The exact people that have have canceled you.
Speaker B:There's.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:So the Tin man was speaking about in Loughborough University, a group of people came together and said, we're going to put together a group for young for men.
Speaker B:Because all the things I listed at the beginning, that was cancelled and they were demonized because they said, how dare you make a group supporting the oppressive people that have been ruling over us?
Speaker B:Which actually isn't true.
Speaker B:Going back to.
Speaker B:Oh, it is true, but the relationship between a man's sort of relationship and sexual success and his social economic status is 0.7.
Speaker B:That is basically unheard of.
Speaker B:There is nothing in any other aspect of social sociology where you find a correlation that high.
Speaker B:I've.
Speaker B:The more and more I think about the world, I think the idea of social constructivism is exceptionally dangerous because it basically justifies everything and it teaches people, tells them if there's a problem, young men are suffering and this.
Speaker B:These people are suffering, et cetera.
Speaker B:The problem is never with.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:So the problem isn't with society.
Speaker B:The problem is with the people.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:What was I.
Speaker B:What did you just say?
Speaker B:Because she says really good.
Speaker A:What's stopping men from coming together, hurting each other?
Speaker A:And you said, the people.
Speaker A:The same people who've canceled me.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:And what you've said about that example in Loughborough, obviously, I think that's completely wrong, what happened there.
Speaker A:I think it's.
Speaker A:It still feels like men are sort of expecting women to help them in the like.
Speaker A:Or for International Men's Day.
Speaker A:There was a viral tweet that some guy said, oh, look, International Men's Day has.
Speaker A:Nothing has happened for it.
Speaker A:And someone replied, saying, who did you expect to organize it?
Speaker A:Women?
Speaker A:Like, it's not.
Speaker A:I understand that the counseling thing and the.
Speaker A:The prevention of that organization going ahead is wrong, but how is that the fault of.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker A:Maybe you're not saying it's the fault of feminism, but I, I just.
Speaker A:I'm very cautious of the fact that I feel like women once again are being blamed for not accommodating men into their.
Speaker A:Their struggle, if that's what you want to call it.
Speaker A:I just think that to some extent men have to.
Speaker B:Yeah, the.
Speaker B:The answer.
Speaker B:Listen, any man that's struggling in life, the answer is, you have to better yourself.
Speaker B:So we're obviously spiking is a massive problem at the moment for young.
Speaker B:For young women, and it has been for a while, and there's a government initiative to sort it out.
Speaker B:And that's quite correct, but the amount.
Speaker A:Of that, I don't agree with that, by the way, I think.
Speaker A:Which then you agree with Keir Starmer's announcement that spiking is gonna be an official legal offense.
Speaker A:It's already.
Speaker A:It's already illegal to poison someone.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And so it's completely performative.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, of course.
Speaker B:It is.
Speaker B:Virtually signaling.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:He came on this warning and he.
Speaker B:This is.
Speaker B:This is what the left do.
Speaker B:This is the weaponization.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:That is the biggest Jesus.
Speaker B:The Bible.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Jesus's biggest enemies were the Pharisees.
Speaker B:And the Pharisees were people who used the prevailing problems of the era to elevate their own status.
Speaker B:And that's what the left do all the time.
Speaker B:Virtue signaling is beyond evil.
Speaker B:It's one of the worst things I think you can do.
Speaker B:And it's all linked in everything we've spoken about today.
Speaker B:But no one cares about the amount of men that kill themselves every year.
Speaker A:You aware of what November is?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Universities is the biggest at Leeds anyway.
Speaker A:And I'm at every other university that I see.
Speaker A:It's the biggest month of fundraising throughout the academic year.
Speaker A:To say that no one cares about pride themselves is absolutely ridiculous.
Speaker A:Pride isn't about necessarily raising money.
Speaker A:November is all about raising money and raising awareness about men who kill themselves, which is great.
Speaker A:I think it's.
Speaker A:I think it's great that we're raising awareness about it.
Speaker A:But to say that no one cares is.
Speaker A:I'm sorry, but that is absolutely ridiculous.
Speaker B:Do you think so?
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:Did you go to university?
Speaker B:Yes, I did.
Speaker A:Did you not have Movember?
Speaker A:Was it not a massive thing?
Speaker B:No, not what.
Speaker A:What our sports societies do for Movember is absolutely incredible.
Speaker A:And again, maybe it's Leeds, but all of my friends who are at university.
Speaker B:How could the men's group be cancelled in Loughborough if everyone.
Speaker A:No, I actually, I find it unbelievable that that was the case.
Speaker A:Maybe I don't know it.
Speaker A:I don't know the case in detail, but I know that at Lough.
Speaker A:I know people at Loughborough who spent the whole month fundraising for November running ridiculously high.
Speaker A:Like running such a ridiculous amount of kilometers in one month to raise money for Movember and pushing their bodies to extremes, like the cricket club at Leeds.
Speaker A:Every year they raised.
Speaker A:I think they must have raised, maybe they raised at least over £2,000.
Speaker A:This, this Movember, they do a 24 hour charity run.
Speaker A:Every Movember they run for 24 hours as a club in stints is where there's everything that's on the last day and they do so much for it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:To say and everyone growing moustaches, weekly updates, and they're always asking for donations, and they put on events to encourage people to talk about their mental health.
